Brampton Battalion @ Niagara IceDogs

[Schtick]

http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h45/Schtick81/OHL%20Logos/battalion.gif VS http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h45/Schtick81/OHL%20Logos/n_icedogs.gif

Season Record

Brampton Battalion - 0-1-0-0

Niagara IceDogs - 1-0-0-0


I just purchased my tickets for tomorrow's game, the game that I wasn't going to go, but I just can't live with myself if I miss it.
Anyways, as I was buying my tickets today, I was told that the tickets for tomorrow's game vs Brampton were selling like crazy, which is obviously a great sign!! and I hope that they keep selling like crazy for the next 5 years and beyond!!!
After buying tickets today I am realizing that I should have just bought season tickets this year now that I know that the IceDog games won't interfere with mt weekly Jr. B Welland games.
Oh well, there's always next year. :)

Just thought that i would let you guys know that the three people that I brought with me loved the home opener lastnite and have asked me to pick up tickets for next weeks game vs Sudbury, so already I need to pick up fifteen tickets for next Sundays game!

"Let's Go IceDogs"


IceDogs mark new territory

Posted: Saturday, Sep. 22, 2007





"BRAMPTON, Ont. – The Brampton Battalion is set to face a familiar foe in a new setting.

The Troops, who opened their Ontario Hockey League season Friday night with a 2-1 home-ice loss to the Ottawa 67’s, visit the Niagara IceDogs at 2 p.m. Sunday in the first of six meetings.

For nine years the Battalion and Mississauga IceDogs, who both entered the OHL for the 1998-99 season, squared off as regional rivals, but the IceDogs were sold after the 2006-07 campaign and moved to St. Catharines, where they were rebranded as the Niagara IceDogs. The Toronto St. Michael’s Majors also moved, taking up residency at Mississauga’s Hershey Centre.

The Battalion and IceDogs, who have never met in the playoffs, faced each other in 64 regular-season games, with the Troops forging a won-lost-tied record of 36-23-5, including three overtime losses, against the Peel Region neighbours.

Battalion head coach Stan Butler is no stranger to the IceDogs’ new home rink, the former Jack Gatecliff Arena, which was recently renamed the Gatorade Garden City Complex. Butler played hockey and lacrosse at the arena, built in 1938, while a student at Brock University in St. Catharines.

“I’ve played a few games there over the years and I’m looking forward to going back. Obviously we’re looking to get some points out of this game.”

Battalion left winger Conor O’Donnell, who hails from Hamilton, Ont., said he knows there is plenty of excitement in the area as junior hockey returns to St. Catharines for the first time since 1976-77, when the St. Catharines Fincups called the city home.

“I’m excited,” said O’Donnell, whose father, Chris, works in St. Catharines.

“My dad knows a lot of people who will be coming out to the game. I’ve heard they’ve been selling a lot of tickets and I know a lot of people in that area love hockey. They come out to junior B and junior C games, and I think there will be a big crowd for our game there.”

The IceDogs opened their season Friday night, posting a 4-1 win over the visiting Majors before a sellout crowd of 3,145.

“They’re going to have a good team,” said O’Donnell, in his second season with the Troops. “They have a lot of guys returning, just like us. Against Ottawa we really didn’t get going until the second period, but for this game we should be ready to go from the start.”

The IceDogs, who boast 16 players who played for Mississauga last season, added overage centre Jordan Foreman in an offseason trade with the London Knights.

Foreman won’t be in the lineup Sunday while serving the second game of a two-game suspension arising from a preseason brawl with the visiting Plymouth Whalers. Head coach Mario Cicchillo, an assistant in Mississauga for the last four seasons under head coaches Greg Gilbert and Mike Kelly, received the same sanction.

Fans in the Brampton area can see the game live on Rogers Cable 10."

[GoDogsGo]

great stuff.. adictive isn't it.... I too wish I bough season tickets...

[trooper]

i so mad i can't make the game tommarow

[GoDogsGo]

especially with the tailgate going on.... and a nice warm day...

[WellandDogsFan]

It's not too late to purchase season tickets. The big benefit to season tickets is that you will get first crack at playoff tickets (am I putting the cart before the horse??). And if you dont like the seats you purchase this year, you will be able to move your seats to a part of the arena that you may like better, provided they arent already taken. If you could afford it, I would advise you to get them now!!

[AlphaDog]

Excellent post/info Schtick! I'll be there tomorrow too! (of course)

PS: when posting articles please include who wrote it. EG: If it's from the Standard or whatever, just try and make sure it says that.

I want this site to contain a HUGE amount of info from all sorts of sources, but we've got to make sure credit is given where due. Thanks!
(that goes for all - including me :) If you see something uncredited please PM me and let me know.

[RioBravo]

Great read...the Battalion better get ready for us...

[Schtick]

[quote=AlphaDog;1748]Excellent post/info Schtick! I'll be there tomorrow too! (of course)

PS: when posting articles please include who wrote it. EG: If it's from the Standard or whatever, just try and make sure it says that.
[quote]

Sorry about that AlphaDog, I actually posted the source in my post, but I somehow deleted it by accident, notice the gap between the title of the story and the starting paragraph, that's where the "source/credit" of the story was posted, Iam not sure what I did to delete it.

[GoDogsGo]

that's happened too me too... it was in the text and once posted... it was gone... weird...

[AlphaDog]

[quote=AlphaDog;1748]Excellent post/info Schtick! I'll be there tomorrow too! (of course)

PS: when posting articles please include who wrote it. EG: If it's from the Standard or whatever, just try and make sure it says that.
[quote]

Sorry about that AlphaDog, I actually posted the source in my post, but I somehow deleted it by accident, notice the gap between the title of the story and the starting paragraph, that's where the "source/credit" of the story was posted, Iam not sure what I did to delete it.

No problem man!

[RioBravo]

Well, the 2nd period was one of the worst periods I think i've ever seen a team play. Some very questionable calls stick out, especially the four minute penalty to Legein... That snipe by Legein at the end of the second was also a hell of a shot. As dreadful as the 2nd period was. The third was some of the most entertaining hockey i've seen in a while. I really thought they were going to make it back. Us as a crowd has really started to get into it and today was just as loud as Friday in the third even with 1000 less people.

[Quizzer83]

I, for one, was quite impressed with how the crowd got into things in the 3rd period.

The refereeing - not so much. The penalty late to MacEachern being the obvious case, I was also quite unimpressed with the penalty given to Legein in the third for, IIRC, breathing on Sanguinetti in the Brampton zone hard enough to make Sanguinetti fall over on his own.

[WellandDogsFan]

Today was a day of disappointments. First of all, I was disappointed with the attendance. I thought for sure we would have another sell out crowd. The announced attendance of a bit over 2k, while impressive, should have been larger. There were wayyyyy to many empty seats. Another disappointment I had today was the outcome of the game. While I had no illusions of going 68-0, I thought we would have 4 points at the end of the weekend. But the biggest disappointment though was the play of the second period. I hope the team learned a lesson today...the lesson being that you cant take a shift off and certainly not a whole period.

Having said that, there were a number of positives today as well. Topping that list is the crowd noise. While the crowd may have been substantially smaller, I think we made more noise than the home opener. At times, it was deafening. I was very impressed with how the crowd got into the game, especially in the third. I was also impressed with how the Dogs battled back in the third after falling to a three goal deficit.

I think the Dogs can go a long way this year. We get Foreman back on Thursday! I cant wait to see him in a game that counts next Sunday.

While some may read this and think that I have fallen off the bandwagon, nothing could be further from the truth. I know there will be bumps in the road during the course of a long season....and today was one of those bumps.

See everybody on Sunday!

[AlphaDog]

Today was a day of disappointments. First of all, I was disappointed with the attendance. I thought for sure we would have another sell out crowd. The announced attendance of a bit over 2k, while impressive, should have been larger. There were wayyyyy to many empty seats. Another disappointment I had today was the outcome of the game. While I had no illusions of going 68-0, I thought we would have 4 points at the end of the weekend. But the biggest disappointment though was the play of the second period. I hope the team learned a lesson today...the lesson being that you cant take a shift off and certainly not a whole period.

Yah that 2nd period put me to sleep almost. The first 5 minutes they had a lot of jump in them, and the last 10mins of the game were GREAT with the crowd chanting, the scoring opportunities. I just don't now what happened to the guys in between.

Having said that, there were a number of positives today as well. Topping that list is the crowd noise. While the crowd may have been substantially smaller, I think we made more noise than the home opener. At times, it was deafening. I was very impressed with how the crowd got into the game, especially in the third. I was also impressed with how the Dogs battled back in the third after falling to a three goal deficit.

Great to see their will to win hadn't diminished after going down 5-3! If they would have played with the energy in the last 10 mins all 60 mins, it would have been 7-1 Niagara. (that score comes of course with very much scientific research :cool:

I think the Dogs can go a long way this year. We get Foreman back on Thursday! I cant wait to see him in a game that counts next Sunday.

That's great news. With Foreman and Fletcher in the lineup, it'll be a tough lineup. I wish Fletch could have had some more icetime yesterday though.

While some may read this and think that I have fallen off the bandwagon, nothing could be further from the truth. I know there will be bumps in the road during the course of a long season....and today was one of those bumps.

Hey man, tell it like it is. We can't sugar-coat our messages throughout the entire year. They just had an off-game yesterday. It's going to be a great season.

[IceDogArmy]

well everyone has pretty much expressed my opinion of the game. i think the turn out was a bit of a disappointment for the players also. i know i was disappointed, but 2,000+ is a good turn out for a "summer" day in late sept. but i would like to say that Mr Burke is such a down to earth great guy, he hung out with me after the game got a bunch of us some beers and hotdogs, hell he even poured the beers himself. even the office staff are real nice people. not only do we have a great on ice team but a great front office team , kudos to them.

[WellandDogsFan]

but i would like to say that Mr Burke is such a down to earth great guy, he hung out with me after the game got a bunch of us some beers and hotdogs, hell he even poured the beers himself. even the office staff are real nice people. not only do we have a great on ice team but a great front office team , kudos to them.

I couldnt agree with you more. Both Bill and Denise Burke are not only great owners but great people. I think they are providing great leadership for the entire organization. We, the fans, are very lucky to have people like the Burke's leading the club.

I second the kudos to the Burke's and the front office staff. Winning starts at the top!

[AlphaDog]

well everyone has pretty much expressed my opinion of the game. i think the turn out was a bit of a disappointment for the players also. i know i was disappointed, but 2,000+ is a good turn out for a "summer" day in late sept. but i would like to say that Mr Burke is such a down to earth great guy, he hung out with me after the game got a bunch of us some beers and hotdogs, hell he even poured the beers himself. even the office staff are real nice people. not only do we have a great on ice team but a great front office team , kudos to them.

You figure there's not going to be a whole lot of hot sunny weekends left like we had this weekend. People are closing up their cottages or at least spending as much time there as possible, boating, etc... plus about 5 people that I know that usually go couldn't make it because of work, so I'm guessing they weren't the only 5 that were kept from the game because of work.

Yah, owner Bill Burke is another reason I really want to see this franchise do well. His enthusiasm for the whole OHL atmosphere seems genuine - he seems like a fan of the game just as much as the next guy, and not just some businessman controlling things behind the scene. 'Very hands-on.

I'm still stickin by my point that no parking is a reason people are scared to come on a regular basis, and that goes for all teams prior to the Dogs. You know if you get there only 20-30 minutes early you could be driving around in circles for 15 mins. on busy downtown roads trying to find a spot.

Other sites think we whine too much about the parking, but it's a VALID point. If someone doesn't already have tickets to the game and are THINKING about going, the problem finding parking can be a big deterent from them coming. I've talked to and overheard SO many people this year already who have said the same thing.

I can remember as a kid going down with my parents to watch the Saints play, even then I can remember ma and pa saying that it was "too late to leave to find parking". This is a problem that's been with that arena since day 1.

If people knew that as long as they got to the game 15-20 mins early they'd have a parking spot in a big lot next to the arena waiting for them, they'd be a lot more willing to go. "What are you doing this afternoon? I dunno. Wanna go to the Dogs game? Sure why not!"... instead "Wanna go to the Dogs game? Nah.. all the parking will be taken already".

Heck, even yesterday I was speeding down Geneva to get to the arena so I wouldn't be driving in circles. And that was 45mins before the game!

Ok, I've complained enough today on the parking. Other sites operators feel free to knock me for complaining.... (I love the hate mail).

[WellandDogsFan]

People are closing up their cottages or at least spending as much time there as possible, boating, etc...

It looks like I am going to miss the Guelph game for that reason. I promised months ago to help a friend close up her cottage. Made the commitment long before the Dogs announced they were moving. I have to find a way to get out of helping out lol

[GoDogsGo]

it was a good game...we almost got it... the reffing was a little debatable...but what can ya do... we really enjoyed ourselves again....Anyone make it to the tailgate...we went in there for a few mins...but then the kid wanted to wonder the arena and look for Bones...which was fine with me.

Anyone see security swooping in for the rowdies sitting to the right of the Dogs bench... it was great to see them act so quick. Gave them a few warnings and they settled down.

The crowd was good, but I expected more people to show-up being a Sunday aft game. 2000+ isnt too bad i guess.

The guys defence fell apart a few times but they were able to regroup.

I love the video screens and the instant replays...what a great touch.

[strohs]

Here are my observations of this game:

#1 - The crowd - I was disappointed in the crowd, I was hoping for around 2,500, guessed there would be 2,300, and there was only 2,083. Granted, it was an absolutely beauty day out, and the last place I'd like to be on a day like that would be in an arena, but heck, the hockey is great, affordable, and the battalion have some great future nhl'ers, including sanguinetti, man, he's a stud on D.

#2 - The second period the dogs were terrible, however, they dominated the third period, and, I think, if not for that questionable penalty call with 3 minutes left in the game, they would have tied it up. Loved to see a never die attitude with the dogs that game.

#3 - Lover. He really didn't have a chance on the goals scored against him, I don't think, so, I think he's still pretty solid. Much better than the other two during preseason action.

#4 - The arena improvements have been great, the concession stands under section A are great, cuz it was a PITA to walk to the main concession stands during pre-season, glad they're open now. I love the arena without the ceiling on it, much better now, and it was actually a little chilly in there yesterday (had shorts and sandles on)...was steamy friday night, but maybe thats what an exta 1000 bodies do.

#5 - In the first two games now, I've run into Bill Burke, and yesterday, the suspended coach, Cicchillo. Both were heading to the founders club during the intermission, Burkey in game #1, and Cicchillo in game #2. Both were quite gracious in chatting with me for a few mins or so, I kept it short as I'm sure they're busy guys. The conversation with Cicchillo was enjoyable. This was after period 1 of the Battalion game, when Legein was taking all these stupid penalties. So I said to Mario, whats up with Legein, was he like this last year? Mario says no, I said to him, that he's gotta reel him in, when he gets back, and get him more disciplined...I said, maybe he's like this cuz you're not behind the bench, and he says, "yes, I think it could be that, you know what they say, when the cats away, the mice will play"...we both laughed after that, and then we talked abit how he is great on the PK, with 3 shortys already this year, and he agreed, we then parted ways with a handshake...was a nice exchange.

Of course, I don't want to sell Burkey short, he was able to stop and shake hands and talk briefly during the intermission of game #1, what a great guy, I've met him three times now, and he's always got a smile on his face, enthusiastic, and willing to share a brief conversation....great guy, I hope he can pull this off!!!!

#6 - Parking - yes, perhaps its true, but, I am no longer complaining about it, instead of trying to find a spot in the dumpy streets around the arena, for 15 bloody minutes, park in the lower level lot, have a short little walk, and enjoy the atmosphere of the crowd walking to the game......soooooooooooo sick of hearing about parking complaints.

#7 - the video screens - they are absolutely great, much better than I had anticipated. I am a big fan of them.

I cannot wait until game #3, next sunday, when the wolves come to town. Unfortunately, then I'll have to miss a few games, due to wife conflicts....ahhhhh, to be single again......lol

Carl
Sec B, Row B, seat 7

[AlphaDog]

Anyone see security swooping in for the rowdies sitting to the right of the Dogs bench... it was great to see them act so quick. Gave them a few warnings and they settled down.
The guys defence fell apart a few times but they were able to regroup.

I love the video screens and the instant replays...what a great touch.

Was it for the ones who seemed to be trying to pushed the glass out? (I thought WellandDogsFan would have had things under control in HIS section <grin> )

Yah - defence is going to be our biggest issue this year. I love seeing 4-5 goals a game scored, but if it's at the cost of our guys coming back to play defensively... I dunno. Of course I prefer high scoring games to the trap, but even though this team is known for having offensive firepower, it's almost letting in as many goals a game as they're scoring.

THe one thing I'd like to have seen yesterday is more pucks to the net. It seemed the entire 2nd period and half the 3rd, they were moving it around to much and it was gettin picked off by Brampton eventually. Dump and Chase once in awhile isn't a bad thing, especially with our speed. 2 on 2? Dump it in, 2 fowards go in for the chase, the trailing forward goes to the net. Too much puck movement yesterday with not enough result.

[strohs]

One thing I really noticed, was losing a lot of faceoffs...especially on the PP, tough to start the PP when you don't have the puck, kinda wastes a bit of time.

I think the defense is solid, however, they really really like to move up into the play, schiestel, and pieterangelo, for sure....perhaps if/when corrente comes back, that will help, as I think he's a solid, more stay at home type, no?

I'd lik eto see more shots from the point on the PP, wonder if the PK figured out they were really going to pass a lot on the PP, and not so much load up for the shot from the point.

[GoDogsGo]

what do they say... the more you shoot the better your chances of something going in...we saw that come true in game 1...

WellandDogsFan-- take control of your section...damn it.. LOL...

[Quizzer83]

I must say, with the way the crowd was in the last 10 minutes, I can't wait to hear what a full barn will sound like...

[GoDogsGo]

I must say, with the way the crowd was in the last 10 minutes, I can't wait to hear what a full barn will sound like...
did you miss the opener....

now that was a loud place... it was great...:D:D

[RioBravo]

I must say it was GREAT to finally hear some loud "Go Dogs Go!" chants going. Some people gotta lighten up and just join in!

[GoDogsGo]

aint that the truth....
we have to get some horns in there...like the brampton fan...3 or 4 of those..and the place is rockin...
Anyone know where to get those...?
http://www.ocanadagear.com/graphics/horn-redplastic1.jpg

[WellandDogsFan]

Was it for the ones who seemed to be trying to pushed the glass out? (I thought WellandDogsFan would have had things under control in HIS section <GRIN>)

well you would have thought so.... they gave me a headache, or was it the second period?? I forget now lol

[WellandDogsFan]

I must say it was GREAT to finally hear some loud "Go Dogs Go!" chants going. Some people gotta lighten up and just join in!

Boy it got loud didnt it?

[GoDogsGo]

i loved it... nothing better than a roaring crowed... and you could tell...at least from where i was sitting that it did effect the guys on the ice... I saw a few guys on the bench hitting their sticks...to GoDOGSGo...

[WellandDogsFan]

i loved it... nothing better than a roaring crowed... and you tell...at least from where i was sitting that it did effect the guys on the ice... I saw a few guys on the bench hitting their sticks...to GoDOGSGo...
yeah I saw that too. I half expected to see someone on the bench to raise their arms to get the crowd even louder.

[GoDogsGo]

it'll happen... i saw a few smiles from the coaching staff when it got loud...

[Cold Pooch]

One thing I really noticed, was losing a lot of faceoffs...especially on the PP, tough to start the PP when you don't have the puck, kinda wastes a bit of time.

I think the defense is solid, however, they really really like to move up into the play, schiestel, and pieterangelo, for sure....perhaps if/when corrente comes back, that will help, as I think he's a solid, more stay at home type, no?

I'd lik eto see more shots from the point on the PP, wonder if the PK figured out they were really going to pass a lot on the PP, and not so much load up for the shot from the point.

NO is yes, if you know what I mean. He is not a stay at home Dman. He will push the offence all the time just like Schiestel, Petro and Day. Last year they had Martine do it as well, this is why the team was the highest scoring team in all of Canada.

The reason they lost in the first round was changing their D style to a trap on going away from the run and gun style they played the season by. IMO that was their downfall.

This is the new NHL no trap and lots of offence from the back end, so get use to it because that is what you will see. ;)

[Schtick]

aint that the truth....
we have to get some horns in there...like the brampton fan...3 or 4 of those..and the place is rockin...
Anyone know where to get those...?
http://www.ocanadagear.com/graphics/horn-redplastic1.jpg

I got my horn last year at a Hamilton Bulldogs game, mind you, I found this website where you can order cheering horns and other noise makers from

http://www.cheeringstuff.com/shop/index.php?cPath=0&sort=2a&page=2

[GoDogsGo]

that's a great link... thanks for that... I may order a few...or I will call the dogs and see if they will be having any...

[RioBravo]

I have an actual air horn and its not half as loud as those ones...kinda sucks.

[Schtick]

that's a great link... thanks for that... I may order a few...or I will call the dogs and see if they will be having any...

Yes, I agree see if the IceDogs will be selling anything like that first, it is always better to support the teams concession first.

That guy with the red horn at the Brampton vs Niagara game was suprisingly entertaining, and I look forward to seeing all sorts of dedicated away fans like that all season long.

[GoDogsGo]

he was great... had a great crew with him too... that horn was sooo loud...i loved it...

[TheQuietOne]

The crowd noise was fantastic during that last period, I can't wait to hear the noise from a sellout crowd in a tight game down to the wire. The only complaint I have is the PA system drowning out 'Go Dogs Go' chants forming during stoppages in play. Especially with fast faceoffs, there's no reason to kill that when the crowd starts to get into it.

Otherwise, I retract many of my criticizms of the team that I threw out during the summer. Kudos to the team for finding a sponsor for the arena, and for finding a unique niche by selling pina coladas at the arena. Very classy listing all sponsors and season's ticket holders on the back of programs - make sure you tell sponsors that you support them because of their association with the team. I love the drop down screens, the only thing now missing is a shot clock, and that is way down the priority list.

As for the game, I was impressed by our special teams play, despite the lack of finish on the early power plays. We got many 2 on 2's on the PK, and dominated the PP in the second half of the game. Brampton has a hell of a player in Sanguinetti, he burned my Rangers many times as a member of Owen Sound. I also felt we were trying for too many fancy passes in front of open nets to try for the perfect shot. Even though we rang up 45 shots on net, we could have had quite a few more and maybe one or two could have trickled into the net.

[RioBravo]

The crowd noise was fantastic during that last period, I can't wait to hear the noise from a sellout crowd in a tight game down to the wire. The only complaint I have is the PA system drowning out 'Go Dogs Go' chants forming during stoppages in play. Especially with fast faceoffs, there's no reason to kill that when the crowd starts to get into it.

Otherwise, I retract many of my criticizms of the team that I threw out during the summer. Kudos to the team for finding a sponsor for the arena, and for finding a unique niche by selling pina coladas at the arena. Very classy listing all sponsors and season's ticket holders on the back of programs - make sure you tell sponsors that you support them because of their association with the team. I love the drop down screens, the only thing now missing is a shot clock, and that is way down the priority list.

As for the game, I was impressed by our special teams play, despite the lack of finish on the early power plays. We got many 2 on 2's on the PK, and dominated the PP in the second half of the game. Brampton has a hell of a player in Sanguinetti, he burned my Rangers many times as a member of Owen Sound. I also felt we were trying for too many fancy passes in front of open nets to try for the perfect shot. Even though we rang up 45 shots on net, we could have had quite a few more and maybe one or two could have trickled into the net.

There was a shot clock up working in the game for a bit then they stopped. It seemed like they were having trouble but they do have one up.

[Boner]

aint that the truth....
we have to get some horns in there...like the brampton fan...3 or 4 of those..and the place is rockin...
Anyone know where to get those...?
http://www.ocanadagear.com/graphics/horn-redplastic1.jpg

The big dollarama store at the Seaway Mall in Welland sells those horns. They are $1 each, in blue last I saw, I have one in my closet. A dedicated fan from Welland should hit the dollarama and buy a dozen or 2 of them and hand em out during Sundays game. I'm sure if you look around, you will see them in any larger size dollar store.
A friend of mine used to have a 4' long stainless steel horn from a truck that hooked up to an air compressor. That thing could be heard 10 blocks away!!! Maybe he's still got it. :D

Cheers
-Boner

[Quizzer83]

I used to have a blue one that I got at an Argos game 5 years ago; I think it might be sitting at my parents' place in Guelph.

[GoDogsGo]

this is getting better and better... bring all those horns to the game folks. and make it LOUD

[RioBravo]

If they have those at Dollarama I will definitely take a look before next game and pick one up.

[TheQuietOne]

If anyone is making a road trip to Kingston with the team, I got my horn at the Frontenacs team store.

[GoDogsGo]

checked 3 dollar stores in st.kitts and no one carries them...then i checked a party supply store... dude had no idea what i was talking about...