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  #91  
Old 07-27-2019, 10:45 AM
modaymorninggm modaymorninggm is offline
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Hanging onto Tomasino until next year will indeed increase his trade value in terms of players coming back. It being an OHL Mem Cup year will also boost his value. The only risk here is that he does not return after this year and ends up in the NHL as a 19 year old. The NHL is getting younger and younger every year and most people here feel he is a star in waiting. That is the risk with him making it and the IceDogs get nothing for him. It is a difficult position to be in
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  #92  
Old 07-28-2019, 11:38 PM
5 for fighting 5 for fighting is offline
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Originally Posted by modaymorninggm View Post
Hanging onto Tomasino until next year will indeed increase his trade value in terms of players coming back. It being an OHL Mem Cup year will also boost his value. The only risk here is that he does not return after this year and ends up in the NHL as a 19 year old. The NHL is getting younger and younger every year and most people here feel he is a star in waiting. That is the risk with him making it and the IceDogs get nothing for him. It is a difficult position to be in
Maybe I am reading you wrong, but are you suggesting that trading a 1st round NHL selected player with only half a year of eligibility remaining will get more in a trade than trading the same player with 1.5 years of eligibility?

We would get more assets coming back if we trade him this season. There is no debate about this. The only debate should be whether teams will be able to give us enough if we trade him this season.
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  #93  
Old 07-28-2019, 11:44 PM
5 for fighting 5 for fighting is offline
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Provide me one example of a star player traded a year before his final year (OA year excluded) that produced a "more than significant" return – and then I’ll provide 10 examples of players traded in their final year that produced a "significant" return.
So are you saying that if we trade him this season we won’t get anything more than if we trade him next season? That whether a player has half a season or 1.5 seasons remaining doesn’t matter to the team acquiring the player?

Last edited by 5 for fighting; 07-28-2019 at 11:46 PM.
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  #94  
Old 07-28-2019, 11:53 PM
5 for fighting 5 for fighting is offline
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…and lets not also forget that OHLInsiders‏ is full of

According to him: “…part Two gets done come June 1st. Have heard it's just for a 2nd Round Pick and paperwork is done and just post-dated. Seeing as the trade did not work out for Niagara - I would not be surprised if they pull out…”

There was never any truth to this part two rumour. It was pretty clear he has a bone to pick with the Icedogs and if he was still active - would have used this ridiculous rumour to slam JB for being “shady” and “pulling out” of this deal.
You seem to have a short memory. OHLinsider broke the Oshawa trade weeks before it was official. He also said Thomas would be out of the lineup with an injury before any else knew this. In fact the IceDogs denied both the Oshawa trade and Thomas injury. And at that time, people like you said OHLinsider knows nothing. But he was right in both cases.

The fact is none of us have any idea whether part 2 of the Tomasino trade was accurate or not. But to say OHLinsider is full of it is a little offside to say the least.
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  #95  
Old 07-29-2019, 07:27 AM
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Is OHL Insider one person or one person receiving information from multiple sources? If it’s the latter, it’s entirely possible that the information they go with isn’t correct.
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  #96  
Old 07-29-2019, 07:35 AM
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Originally Posted by 5 for fighting View Post
So are you saying that if we trade him this season we won’t get anything more than if we trade him next season? That whether a player has half a season or 1.5 seasons remaining doesn’t matter to the team acquiring the player?

Here is what I wrote: “Trading a player a year early, does not really amount to much more. You’re not getting an extra 03 star – perhaps a couple of extra picks, but that is hardly worth the trade-off for a fan base or the organization as whole.”

In 2018, Robert Thomas, who like Tomasino is a 1st rd NHL selection, was traded as an 18 year old with 1.5 OHL years remaining. He was traded by London to Hamilton for:

Connor McMichael (11th overall selection 2017 OHL Draft)
2nd 2020
3rd 2022 (turns into a 2nd if Hamilton wins the OHL)
2nd 2023
2nd 2025 (conditional)
2nd 2026 (conditional)


Robert Thomas’ return would have netted London those 2 additional conditional 2nd round picks for a 1.5 player as opposed to a 0.5 player.

I'll stand by my original comment - "receiving a couple of extra picks, is hardly worth the trade-off for a fan base or the organization as whole.”

Ok, it’s your turn:
Provide me one example of a star 18 player traded that produced a "more than significant" return – and then I’ll provide 10 examples of 19 year old players traded that produced a "significant" return.

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  #97  
Old 07-30-2019, 12:08 PM
5 for fighting 5 for fighting is offline
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Originally Posted by Blacksox View Post
Here is what I wrote: “Trading a player a year early, does not really amount to much more. You’re not getting an extra 03 star – perhaps a couple of extra picks, but that is hardly worth the trade-off for a fan base or the organization as whole.”

In 2018, Robert Thomas, who like Tomasino is a 1st rd NHL selection, was traded as an 18 year old with 1.5 OHL years remaining. He was traded by London to Hamilton for:

Connor McMichael (11th overall selection 2017 OHL Draft)
2nd 2020
3rd 2022 (turns into a 2nd if Hamilton wins the OHL)
2nd 2023
2nd 2025 (conditional)
2nd 2026 (conditional)


Robert Thomas’ return would have netted London those 2 additional conditional 2nd round picks for a 1.5 player as opposed to a 0.5 player.

I'll stand by my original comment - "receiving a couple of extra picks, is hardly worth the trade-off for a fan base or the organization as whole.”

Ok, it’s your turn:
Provide me one example of a star 18 player traded that produced a "more than significant" return – and then I’ll provide 10 examples of 19 year old players traded that produced a "significant" return.

***
If we can get 4 second round picks, a third round pick and the 11th overall selected player, I say Trade Tomasino this season. We are missing 6 second round picks, 3 or 4 third round picks and are low on young high end talent. A trade like this would help everywhere.

Are you thinking of the next season after this one. We have no young high end talent at forward. After this season Thomas is gone, Tomasino gets traded and Sopa may not be back for his OA year. What does that leave us at forward. If we trade Tomasino and Thomas this season and acquire a pair of first round forwards, that will help us the next season.

It’s all about rebuilding as fast as you can. If we keep Tomasino it will only hurt our future.
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  #98  
Old 07-30-2019, 01:28 PM
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If we can get 4 second round picks, a third round pick and the 11th overall selected player, I say Trade Tomasino this season. We are missing 6 second round picks, 3 or 4 third round picks and are low on young high end talent. A trade like this would help everywhere.

Are you thinking of the next season after this one. We have no young high end talent at forward. After this season Thomas is gone, Tomasino gets traded and Sopa may not be back for his OA year. What does that leave us at forward. If we trade Tomasino and Thomas this season and acquire a pair of first round forwards, that will help us the next season.

It’s all about rebuilding as fast as you can. If we keep Tomasino it will only hurt our future.
Thomas will be gone at some point this season and the return him will be in the neighborhood of what you wrote above.
I am keeping Tomasino this season.
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  #99  
Old 07-30-2019, 04:51 PM
jumbo1290 jumbo1290 is offline
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Originally Posted by 5 for fighting View Post
Maybe I am reading you wrong, but are you suggesting that trading a 1st round NHL selected player with only half a year of eligibility remaining will get more in a trade than trading the same player with 1.5 years of eligibility?

We would get more assets coming back if we trade him this season. There is no debate about this. The only debate should be whether teams will be able to give us enough if we trade him this season.
teams only know where they stand this year; nobody trades for a high end player hoping for a run next year, they wait and see. so no edge trading high end player early.
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  #100  
Old 07-30-2019, 07:54 PM
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teams only know where they stand this year; nobody trades for a high end player hoping for a run next year, they wait and see. so no edge trading high end player early.
Tomasino is an impact player this year. What team wouldn't want him in a run for a championship? The bonus with him having two years left is that you could sell him again or keep him to stay competitive the year following. Just because the IceDogs empty the cupboards doesn't mean other teams have to.

Also you can't necessarily saw teams only know where they are one year at a time. By the trade deadline last year Ottawa knew they could be competitive that year and likely the next as well.

If the right offer came along at this year's deadline, I would take it.
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