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The Meridian Center All talk, news, comments, on building our new arena go in here.

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  #201  
Old 03-07-2010, 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by AlphaDog View Post
And not to mention, the city would NEVER build out there. They want it as close to as much local business as possible.
The land across from White Oakes is actually in Niagara On The Lake so it doesn't matter where St. Catharines wants to build.
I'm not saying that option is going to happen but I do know that the owners of that land (and it's not Niagara on the Green) have approached the town of Niagara on the Lake with some idea's for that property and a facility was something they had brought up.
As for the renovations, as I understand it, it isn't likely but it is not off the table. So anything is possible.
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  #202  
Old 03-07-2010, 04:53 PM
Bleechers Bleechers is offline
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Enviromental impact

Has anyone here have any idea what is buried under that mess we call the lower level parking?
......well I have talked to some of the old timers who helped fill it in years ago. And lets just say....
dont mess with it!

Has anyone thought about what size parcel of land needed for a new entertainment complex? Now along with
the new Brock Centre, Rebuilding of a second canal lock, much needed parking, and the 406 running right beside. It would just be a big cluster of mass confusion. Lets just say it would be like putting a square peg in a round hole.

So the lower level will be a site for a new arena?..............doubt it

And if a corporation comes and saves the day, which I am assured it will happen. Then they will have a say where it will go....not just the city. Downtown makes no sence!
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  #203  
Old 03-07-2010, 07:29 PM
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I don't think they can find a better spot than by White Oaks. It's right in between the 2 biggest cities in the region, making in a true regional team. It would sure make it easier to hit up all the restaurants and hotels in the Falls for sponsorship money.
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  #204  
Old 03-07-2010, 08:05 PM
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I also think the White Oaks area would be great. Right off the QEW, easier access from the American bridge and perfectly situated between St.Catharines & Niagara Falls. It's a nice area too compared to where the Jack is downtown.
.....The White Oaks area would definitely draw more people from Niagara Falls too while maintaining the St.Catharines support. I don't mind the 20 min drive to the Jack (and will miss the great atmosphere) but there are other people in Niagara Falls who won't make the trek because of the lack of parking, bad location, congested arena etc. This spot makes the most sense.
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  #205  
Old 03-08-2010, 08:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleechers View Post
Enviromental impact

Has anyone here have any idea what is buried under that mess we call the lower level parking?
......well I have talked to some of the old timers who helped fill it in years ago. And lets just say....
dont mess with it!
The city (and many of us here) already know it's contaminated, and they're full aware they have to truck off a lot of the soil before the work gets started. That's not a problem.

Quote:
Has anyone thought about what size parcel of land needed for a new entertainment complex? Now along with
the new Brock Centre, Rebuilding of a second canal lock, much needed parking, and the 406 running right beside. It would just be a big cluster of mass confusion. Lets just say it would be like putting a square peg in a round hole.
The footprint will fit fine. It's already been shown a couple times in this thread.

Quote:
So the lower level will be a site for a new arena?..............doubt it
The city is already on like step 3 or step 4 of their 10 or whatever steps to build it there.

Quote:
And if a corporation comes and saves the day, which I am assured it will happen. Then they will have a say where it will go....not just the city. Downtown makes no sence!
Hmm.. well the city is already halfway through the planning to build it in the lower lot, so I can't see a private entity coming in now and doing something completely different somewhere else.
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  #206  
Old 03-08-2010, 09:42 AM
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What is under the land by White Oaks. I thought it used to be a horse race track.
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  #207  
Old 03-08-2010, 10:27 AM
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If it was half way done with the City then............the shovel would have been bought already !

As for contamination, and being up front with it, ask them to talk about what was, and partially still is buried under Happy Rolphs Pond.

As for Corporations........really? ..................money talks ! Thats something the city dosen't have alot of.

One more thing .......with everything being built, where exactly is eveyone going to park when there are multiple events scheduled for the same day, at different downtown locations ?

I believe it was Martin Luther King who said " Keep The Dream Alive "
But I dont think he was talking about the lower level parking lot as a viable site.

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  #208  
Old 03-08-2010, 12:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleechers View Post
If it was half way done with the City then............the shovel would have been bought already !

As for contamination, and being up front with it, ask them to talk about what was, and partially still is buried under Happy Rolphs Pond.

As for Corporations........really? ..................money talks ! Thats something the city dosen't have alot of.

One more thing .......with everything being built, where exactly is eveyone going to park when there are multiple events scheduled for the same day, at different downtown locations ?

I believe it was Martin Luther King who said " Keep The Dream Alive "
But I dont think he was talking about the lower level parking lot as a viable site.

Niagara Falls is building a 4-pad on the old Cyanimid toxic wasteland. The lower parking lot couldn't be any worse.
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  #209  
Old 03-08-2010, 01:32 PM
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Since I no longer work at the land development company that had a conditional offer to purchase the lower level parking lot lands (3 years ago), here's some information on the soil contamination affecting the property.

I actually coordinated the preparation of both a Phase 1 and Phase 2 ESA for the lands which included detailed borehole testing (we went down 100 ft.) and soils analysis. At 40 ft. in depth (for approx. 5 ft.), the soil had high concentrations of PCB's and other contaminants, the details of which escape me right now. The costs to clean-up (i.e. remediate) were cost prohibitive and our company had to walk away from the offer to purchase. The City was not willing to provide any tax exemptions, grants, or incentives to help offset the remediation costs which were in excess of 10M.

Given the fact our development proposal was for a more sensitive land use (i.e. residential student apartment building), remediation must be more thorough than other land uses such as commercial or industrial. Presumably, the remediation costs to facilitate the development of an entertainment facility would probably not hit 10M, however, it is highly likely that it will be at least a few million.

I don't know all the details of contamination on the former Cyanamid lands, however, the big difference in clean-up costs is likely attributed to the fact that the lower level parking lot had contaminated fill buried 40 ft. down whereas contaminated soil on the Cyanamid lands is likely contained in the topsoil and underburden layer. Excavation and sorting is an extremely expensive undertaking.

As for the issue of whether or not an arena could be accommodated in the lower level lot, despite the fact a few people might have been posting site plans or sketches on this site (sorry I didn't bother looking back to see them), there are a number of constraints which even made it difficult for us to accommodate just one student apartment building. These constraints include the road right-of-ways which will be taken off McGuire and the Parkway (perhaps the City would waive this requirement - they wouldn't for us), the MTO setback off of Hwy. 406, and I seem to recall a significantly wide underground storm sewer that runs along McGuire which actually drains most of Glenridge into 12 mile creek. The current turning radius of McGuire and the Parkway cannot currently accommodate large vehicles (i.e. buses) and this posed another significant constraint because the re-alignments would have chewed up even more lands required for the development. MTO will also require a Traffic Impact Assessment to ensure that traffic does not impact the on/off ramps and ultimately the safety of the highway. Although the City itself may be willing to waive a number of requirements it imposes on developers (or itself in this case), the Province will not be so generous or accommodating.
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  #210  
Old 03-08-2010, 01:51 PM
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Thank You knights05 !

NEXT !

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