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  #31  
Old 10-19-2019, 05:29 PM
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Originally Posted by fishfan51 View Post
Miletic played two seasons in the OHL prior to his OA season. In those two years, he put up 69 points in 100 games. He added 1 assist in 10 playoff games.

In the two seasons prior to this one (Lodnias OA year) Ivan has put up 104 points. He added another 14 points in 10 playoff games.

In a non “go for it” season. To acquire Miletic, JB gave up...

2nd 2018
3rd 2022
2nd 2024
2nd 2025

Some on here like to go strictly by numbers when analyzing trades. We can’t always do that as there are often other circumstances that go unspoken for behind the scenes. Also, the new rule that doesn’t allow trades as far into the future, makes them harder to acquire. Having said that. The numbers Lodnia produced as an 18 and 19 year old far outweigh those of Miletic. The better stats should make up the difference in those factors.

JB should be looking at 4 second round picks for Lodnia based on what he gave up for Miletic.

The rumoured deal of the “non prospect” out of Ottawa that has 3 goals in over 60 games would be highway robbery. The Dogs need to get multiple high end picks for Lodnia. Not a project.

Should be interesting to see how this plays out.
I agree with everything you wrote. In today's restricted economy, anything less than 2 seconds and a third is meaningless. Lodnia does not belong in the OHL but the fact he is here for an OA year is a gift to whatever team aspires to trade for him.
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  #32  
Old 10-20-2019, 12:12 PM
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We can be pretty sure that Lodnia is not going to Ottawa as Kitchener just sent over-age Joseph Garreffa there
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  #33  
Old 10-20-2019, 02:22 PM
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Less then hawel deal he went for 3-3rd
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  #34  
Old 10-20-2019, 07:41 PM
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Originally Posted by strohs View Post
Maybe JB can fleece London like we got fleeced by them in the Militec deal? I actually think this will be an interesting comparable ... comparing the return on a Lodnia deal with what wonder boy JB overpaid for Militec...
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It`s reasonable to expect that IceDog fans will use the Miletic trade to judge the Lodnia trade. However, here is the accurate information regarding the Miletic deal.

The trade was:Sam Miletic and a 2018 3rd
In exchange for: 2018 2nd, 2024 2nd, 2025 2nd, 2022 3rd
*The 3rds cancel out - so the trade was essentially three 2nd*

So if the perception is that JB was fleeced in the Miletic trade – than reviewing the return of similar OA trades is the only way to quantify and evaluate the past trade (Miletic) and the future trade (Lodnia).

At the time of the trade, Miletic, an ELC OA, was a top 5-10 league scorer. So using these comparables:

Top 5-10 scorers when traded
<>Aaron Luchuk (ELC – 2018 Scoring champion) traded for: Curtis Douglas, a 2nd 2021(SBY), a 2nd 2022 and a 3rd 2024
<>Kevin Hancock (Undrafted – 2019 – finished 5th ) traded for: Andrew Perrott and a 3rd 2019

Not top 10 scorers when traded
<>Brandon Saigeon (ELC) (92 pts - 12th ) traded for: 2nd 2019, 2nd 2022, 3rd 2024.
<>Kole Sherwood (ELC) (72 ppg – 28th) traded for: 2nd 2019, 2nd 2020, 3rd 2021 and a 5th 2020

In terms of Sam Miletic, a 2nd instead of a 3rd is the difference from the return of other top 5-10 players - and in the case of the players who finished in the top 5, a significant prospect was required.


So where does Ivan Lodnia currently fit in. Last year, scored at a ppg rate that prorated to 74 pts over 68 games. Which would be good enough to finish #35 in league scoring. So his trade value equates to a player not considered a Top 5-10.

If however, Lodnia plays 25-30 games with the IceDogs, before trading him, he could possibly up his value to a top 5 offensive player but Lodnia has not proven to be that player yet.

If fans reference the trade return of similar players, a fair assessment of the Lodnia trade can be determined.



Comparable 2019-2020 trades that can be referenced at some point:

Drafted/Unsigned OA:
<>Liam Hawel (78pts #25 2019 league scoring)
Traded For: GUE 2 2020*, SBY 2 2023*, MISS 3 2023*

Undrafted/Unsigned OA:
<>Joey Garreffa (87 pts #15 2019 league scoring)
Traded for: OTT 3 2021, OTT 3 2022, OTT 3 2024
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  #35  
Old 10-20-2019, 08:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Blacksox View Post
It`s reasonable to expect that IceDog fans will use the Miletic trade to judge the Lodnia trade. However, here is the accurate information regarding the Miletic deal.



The trade was:Sam Miletic and a 2018 3rd

In exchange for: 2018 2nd, 2024 2nd, 2025 2nd, 2022 3rd

*The 3rds cancel out - so the trade was essentially three 2nd*



So if the perception is that JB was fleeced in the Miletic trade – than reviewing the return of similar OA trades is the only way to quantify and evaluate the past trade (Miletic) and the future trade (Lodnia).



At the time of the trade, Miletic, an ELC OA, was a top 5-10 league scorer. So using these comparables:



Top 5-10 scorers when traded

<>Aaron Luchuk (ELC – 2018 Scoring champion) traded for: Curtis Douglas, a 2nd 2021(SBY), a 2nd 2022 and a 3rd 2024

<>Kevin Hancock (Undrafted – 2019 – finished 5th ) traded for: Andrew Perrott and a 3rd 2019



Not top 10 scorers when traded

<>Brandon Saigeon (ELC) (92 pts - 12th ) traded for: 2nd 2019, 2nd 2022, 3rd 2024.

<>Kole Sherwood (ELC) (72 ppg – 28th) traded for: 2nd 2019, 2nd 2020, 3rd 2021 and a 5th 2020



In terms of Sam Miletic, a 2nd instead of a 3rd is the difference from the return of other top 5-10 players - and in the case of the players who finished in the top 5, a significant prospect was required.





So where does Ivan Lodnia currently fit in. Last year, scored at a ppg rate that prorated to 74 pts over 68 games. Which would be good enough to finish #35 in league scoring. So his trade value equates to a player not considered a Top 5-10.



If however, Lodnia plays 25-30 games with the IceDogs, before trading him, he could possibly up his value to a top 5 offensive player but Lodnia has not proven to be that player yet.



If fans reference the trade return of similar players, a fair assessment of the Lodnia trade can be determined.







Comparable 2019-2020 trades that can be referenced at some point:



Drafted/Unsigned OA:

<>Liam Hawel (78pts #25 2019 league scoring)

Traded For: GUE 2 2020*, SBY 2 2023*, MISS 3 2023*



Undrafted/Unsigned OA:

<>Joey Garreffa (87 pts #15 2019 league scoring)

Traded for: OTT 3 2021, OTT 3 2022, OTT 3 2024


Thanks JB. So if you want to put forth the argument that you weren’t fleeced, how about the argument that ...

It was an unnecessary trade and a super waste of assets?

Also I’m curious how many of those other OA deals were deadline deals or were deals done earlier in the season ?

Either way you slice it the Militec trade was unnecessary and a waste of resources...

People on here were always saying ‘ya no problem we can just get those picks back’

Ok Joey let’s see you get these picks back that you previously frittered away for Sam.

I really don’t get how fans who want to see the Dogs win a championship, can’t be b there’s by their illogical decision to acquire Militec that year.






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  #36  
Old 10-20-2019, 08:54 PM
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Originally Posted by strohs View Post
Thanks JB. So if you want to put forth the argument that you weren’t fleeced, how about the argument that ...

It was an unnecessary trade and a super waste of assets?

Also I’m curious how many of those other OA deals were deadline deals or were deals done earlier in the season ?

Either way you slice it the Militec trade was unnecessary and a waste of resources...

People on here were always saying ‘ya no problem we can just get those picks back’

Ok Joey let’s see you get these picks back that you previously frittered away for Sam.

I really don’t get how fans who want to see the Dogs win a championship, can’t be b there’s by their illogical decision to acquire Militec that year.

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Strohs, you're going in circles - and it does not help make your rebuttals credible.

Did you or did you not write in your previous post… "I actually think this will be an interesting comparable ... comparing the return on a Lodnia deal with what wonder boy JB overpaid for Militec."

I'm simple addressing the inaccurate fact (overpaid) - and best you can do is reply by name calling. It awfully childish for a person of your age.
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  #37  
Old 10-20-2019, 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Blacksox View Post
Strohs, you're going in circles - and it does not help make your rebuttals credible.



Did you or did you not write in your previous post… "I actually think this will be an interesting comparable ... comparing the return on a Lodnia deal with what wonder boy JB overpaid for Militec."



I'm simple addressing the inaccurate fact (overpaid) - and best you can do is reply by name calling. It awfully childish for a person of your age.


I’m not rehashing the whole Militec thing again I’ve said my share on it... you want to justify it go ahead ... it was an utter waste of precious assets... there is NO denying that ...

Let’s see if he can find someone to give up for Lodnia (who was arguably and statistically better than Magic Sam was) what we gave up for Sam.

If he can I will tip my hat ...





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  #38  
Old 10-20-2019, 10:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Blacksox View Post
Strohs, you're going in circles - and it does not help make your rebuttals credible.

Did you or did you not write in your previous post… "I actually think this will be an interesting comparable ... comparing the return on a Lodnia deal with what wonder boy JB overpaid for Militec."

I'm simple addressing the inaccurate fact (overpaid) - and best you can do is reply by name calling. It awfully childish for a person of your age.
Wow, I am starting to feel like we are in a court room.
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  #39  
Old 10-20-2019, 10:48 PM
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Let’s see if he can find someone to give up for Lodnia (who was arguably and statistically better than Magic Sam was) what we gave up for Sam.

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When the trade was made (Jan 9, 2018)...

Prior to this season, Miletic signed an ELC with the Pittsburgh Penguins, and since being returned to the Knights, has played 35 games, compiling 16 goals and 54 points over that timeframe and currently sits fourth in overall league scoring. He finished the season with 92 points in 63 games (prorated 100 pts in 68 games). His 92 points put him 6th in OHL scoring.

Using last years stats, prorated to 68 games Lodnia would have had 74 points. Lodnia will need to really light the lamp in his OA year to be statistically better than Miletic in his OA year. And I really hope he is!
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  #40  
Old 10-21-2019, 10:31 AM
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When the trade was made (Jan 9, 2018)...

Prior to this season, Miletic signed an ELC with the Pittsburgh Penguins, and since being returned to the Knights, has played 35 games, compiling 16 goals and 54 points over that timeframe and currently sits fourth in overall league scoring. He finished the season with 92 points in 63 games (prorated 100 pts in 68 games). His 92 points put him 6th in OHL scoring.

Using last years stats, prorated to 68 games Lodnia would have had 74 points. Lodnia will need to really light the lamp in his OA year to be statistically better than Miletic in his OA year. And I really hope he is!
You're using Miletic's OA numbers VS Lodnia's 19 year old season numbers. We don't know what Lodnia OA's numbers are/will be.

The fair comparison is what they did at the same age. In their respective 19 year old seasons, Lodnia had better numbers than Miletic.

I realize that Miletic had a very good OA year, but I think it's safe to assume that Lodnia will out perform his numbers from last year as well.

Numbers are fun, they can be spun to help both sides of any discussion.
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